1 00:06:11,434 --> 00:06:16,386 Good evening ladies and gentlemen, I am very glad you're here. 2 00:06:16,486 --> 00:06:22,700 I ought to greet everyone personally now, but then I'll forget someone and it gets awkward. 3 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:24,847 I'm just happy that you're here. 4 00:06:24,947 --> 00:06:30,418 I want to greet someone in particular, actually a group: Welcome Anonymous! 5 00:06:31,326 --> 00:06:36,485 And I'm going to start from there because Anonymous and... 6 00:06:36,585 --> 00:06:40,240 ...in relation to me and others sitting at this table... 7 00:06:40,340 --> 00:06:44,202 ...these defamation campaigns from Scientology are running... 8 00:06:44,302 --> 00:06:46,926 And to make it clear once and for all: 9 00:06:47,026 --> 00:06:50,558 Everyone dealing with the Scientology organisation either professionally... 10 00:06:51,177 --> 00:06:56,171 ...or as a victim of this organisation is happy that you are there, 11 00:06:56,271 --> 00:07:00,463 are happy that there is a means of protesting. 12 00:07:00,563 --> 00:07:04,136 That you are doing an incredible job on the internet. 13 00:07:04,236 --> 00:07:10,162 And if I may say so, you help people when they want to leave, too. 14 00:07:10,262 --> 00:07:14,454 I think they are a bunch of wonderful young people. 15 00:07:14,554 --> 00:07:21,717 And if I hear another stupid word against Anonymous from these Scientologists, at some point I'm gonna get angry. 16 00:07:21,817 --> 00:07:23,657 So, Welcome! 17 00:07:32,241 --> 00:07:36,079 Today and tomorrow we're having our conference... 18 00:07:36,179 --> 00:07:39,752 ...our educational conference on the Scientology organisation. 19 00:07:39,852 --> 00:07:46,521 Lately the German media in particular was writing... 20 00:07:46,621 --> 00:07:52,157 ...that Scientology was on the retreat and there were not that many problems anymore and so forth. 21 00:07:52,257 --> 00:07:57,127 Our responsibility is - with me being the head of the task force that is responsible - 22 00:07:57,227 --> 00:08:01,791 to not let us be deceived by this, 23 00:08:01,891 --> 00:08:05,216 but to carry on educating. 24 00:08:05,316 --> 00:08:09,508 That's why we have invited dear guests from the USA. 25 00:08:09,608 --> 00:08:15,988 But before I continue there I'll ask you to give our council of state Dr. Schulz a warm welcome, 26 00:08:16,442 --> 00:08:19,083 as well as to our department head Mr. Willi Weiß [?]. 27 00:08:19,183 --> 00:08:25,563 And now Mr. Schulz, I'd like you to make the formal introduction. 28 00:08:34,271 --> 00:08:41,782 Thank you very much Ms. Caberta, dear representatives of politics, economy, administration, culture and the media. 29 00:08:41,947 --> 00:08:47,766 Dear participants and guests, of course dear Ms. Caberta, Ladies and Gentlemen! 30 00:08:47,866 --> 00:08:57,341 I'd like to welcome you in the name of the senate of the Free Hanseatic City of Hamburg in the Chamber of Crafts to this educational event. 31 00:08:57,441 --> 00:09:03,876 I am glad that after the last big event in September of 2008 in these rooms... 32 00:09:03,976 --> 00:09:09,254 there's once again such interest in this subject, which is still a burning issue. 33 00:09:09,973 --> 00:09:16,111 I thus want to thank the organisers, speakers, guests and participants right at the start... 34 00:09:16,211 --> 00:09:25,566 ...for setting up and supporting this important event, where with good reason you are warned about the Scientology-Organisation. 35 00:09:25,953 --> 00:09:34,690 Ms. Caberta, I want to express my gratitude to you here, and your office Task Force Scientology... 36 00:09:34,790 --> 00:09:39,943 ...for your really magnificent dedication that has lasted for years in this matter. 37 00:09:49,067 --> 00:09:55,869 My thanks go out to the representatives of the Chamber of Crafts, for allowing us to be here this year again. 38 00:09:56,256 --> 00:10:04,495 Ladies and Gentlemen, this meeting today bears the name "Fates in the Scientology-Organisation from Hubbard to Miscavige". 39 00:10:05,379 --> 00:10:11,904 It would be wrong to say "from beginning to end", but all of the development will be outlined. 40 00:10:12,004 --> 00:10:18,042 And Ms. Caberta succeeded - it wasn't easy, still, she is tireless - 41 00:10:18,142 --> 00:10:22,466 to once more gain numerous high ranking speakers. 42 00:10:22,566 --> 00:10:29,820 To ask them to appear here in Hamburg, of course from the USA and of course from other European countries. 43 00:10:29,920 --> 00:10:33,967 After all, this is what provides the high attraction of this event. 44 00:10:34,067 --> 00:10:40,603 It is these accounts from insiders in particular that are of incredibly high value to the educational work, 45 00:10:40,703 --> 00:10:45,469 and that are suited to raise the public's awareness credibly. 46 00:10:45,569 --> 00:10:49,119 One thing is what you say from the outside, which may be true... 47 00:10:49,219 --> 00:10:52,823 ...the other thing may be what people say that come from the inside. 48 00:10:52,923 --> 00:10:55,865 Of course, authenticity is much higher there. 49 00:10:55,965 --> 00:11:00,952 And public discussion about Scientology's ideology, 50 00:11:01,052 --> 00:11:06,205 which is precisely not reconcilable with our liberal democracy, with our core values, 51 00:11:06,305 --> 00:11:10,684 must not subside and Ms. Caberta has mentioned this a moment ago as well. 52 00:11:11,679 --> 00:11:17,762 As always, of importance to the informational and educational work are the developments in the USA. 53 00:11:18,149 --> 00:11:21,964 The decision makers are located there, acting from there. 54 00:11:22,064 --> 00:11:29,761 Insofar, if you are occupying yourself with this naturally you have to deal with these movements from America, too. 55 00:11:30,756 --> 00:11:37,115 And, ladies and gentlemen, even in the USA indeed a critical discussion is taking place. 56 00:11:38,000 --> 00:11:40,710 The most important information, there as well as at our place, 57 00:11:40,810 --> 00:11:46,350 are the people that got recruited and later realize which kind of lord they have served. 58 00:11:47,732 --> 00:11:52,101 From them we can learn about what is happening in their nerve centres authentically, 59 00:11:52,201 --> 00:11:57,022 and apply this to our work in Germany very much to our benefit of course. 60 00:11:57,685 --> 00:11:59,842 This is of special importance, 61 00:11:59,942 --> 00:12:06,256 Because one can only reasonably educate about an internationally operating corporation like Scientology... 62 00:12:06,356 --> 00:12:12,118 ...if also the developments from there get known and thus the possibility exists to inform a broad public. 63 00:12:12,615 --> 00:12:17,813 Owing to our work in Hamburg since 1992, we know exactly how difficult it is... 64 00:12:17,913 --> 00:12:21,020 ...for people to escape the of this organisation. 65 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:26,008 We also know how much courage is needed to then publicly speak out about these experiences... 66 00:12:26,108 --> 00:12:30,089 ...and what kind of animosities you are exposed to personally. 67 00:12:31,140 --> 00:12:36,171 This holds true for our guests as well, that I want to give a warm welcome at this point again... 68 00:12:36,271 --> 00:12:42,420 ...and to personally thank them for accepting the invitation by the office of the interior... 69 00:12:42,520 --> 00:12:46,401 ...and that you're here today so that you can make your contributions... 70 00:12:46,501 --> 00:12:52,152 ...to portray the activities of this organisation as they really are. 71 00:12:53,092 --> 00:13:00,833 I want to again explicitly salute our participants from this country as well as from abroad and outside the USA. 72 00:13:00,933 --> 00:13:06,374 And this shows - and you can rely on that with Ms. Caberta so to speak - 73 00:13:06,474 --> 00:13:08,741 what kind of top-notch event she is running, 74 00:13:08,841 --> 00:13:16,980 and that we from Hamburg are not playing an insignificant part in providing education in Europe. 75 00:13:17,422 --> 00:13:24,002 Ladies and Gentlemen, the Scientology organisation is still rejecting parliamentary democracy, 76 00:13:24,102 --> 00:13:29,532 its expansion endeavours are pursuing the goal to subvert the constitutional order. 77 00:13:29,632 --> 00:13:33,900 It is our understanding that in a political system influenced by the SO... 78 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:38,269 ...our constitution of the Federal Republic of Germany more specifically the human rights, 79 00:13:38,369 --> 00:13:41,531 and the right of our people to fair and equal elections... 80 00:13:41,631 --> 00:13:46,342 ...would in perspective ultimately be abrogated or curtailed. 81 00:13:46,442 --> 00:13:51,042 I am not telling you anything new with this, but I think it is important, 82 00:13:51,142 --> 00:13:55,189 even in such a short welcoming speech, to simply repeat this point. 83 00:13:55,632 --> 00:13:58,341 Ladies and gentlemen, we have top-class speakers, 84 00:13:58,441 --> 00:14:02,765 so I don't want to encroach on your time with my welcoming speech. 85 00:14:02,865 --> 00:14:05,530 I only want to briefly talk on one point. 86 00:14:06,304 --> 00:14:12,497 In addition to the education about the structures of the organisation of Scientology from insiders, 87 00:14:12,884 --> 00:14:19,354 naturally information concerning the fates of individuals, what is happening to them individually... 88 00:14:19,454 --> 00:14:27,925 ...as members of Scientology, how they suffer in regards to finance, humanity and their psyche to be there. 89 00:14:28,025 --> 00:14:32,956 To outline this fate is part of the educational work as well, 90 00:14:33,056 --> 00:14:38,265 and just today or yesterday we have a discussion in the German and Hamburg news papers, 91 00:14:38,365 --> 00:14:44,524 since next week on Wednesday we have a television film dedicating itself to the subject Scientology, too, 92 00:14:44,624 --> 00:14:51,049 but from the view point of a television story, the depiction of an individual fate. 93 00:14:51,149 --> 00:14:57,010 And I believe this movie can contribute a great deal to education, 94 00:14:57,110 --> 00:15:02,982 but to make clear to people, within the scope of such a 90 minute movie: 95 00:15:03,082 --> 00:15:06,245 What is happening to these people as individuals? 96 00:15:06,345 --> 00:15:08,512 That is a vital part... 97 00:15:08,612 --> 00:15:11,830 Here too, Ms. Caberta has made a decisive contribution to this movie. 98 00:15:11,930 --> 00:15:15,534 Not in its leading role but through numerous informations, 99 00:15:15,634 --> 00:15:20,290 assistance and practial hints about Scientology. 100 00:15:20,390 --> 00:15:25,819 I think, Ms. Caberta, this should be spoken about in short as well: 101 00:15:26,317 --> 00:15:33,008 For the educational work it's important that people are not only reached with rational arguments but with individual fates, too. 102 00:15:33,108 --> 00:15:37,985 Ladies and gentlemen, I wish you an interesting and successful event. 103 00:15:38,085 --> 00:15:41,966 The program is top-notch and I believe it will be successful. 104 00:15:42,066 --> 00:15:46,942 To all of you on this occasion of course a stay in the Free Hanseatic City of Hamburg, 105 00:15:47,042 --> 00:15:51,698 which just in time for the begin of this conference is showing itself from its best side... 106 00:15:51,798 --> 00:15:57,670 ...after two months the winter is finally over, spring has arrived, perhaps a good omen. 107 00:15:57,770 --> 00:16:03,034 Godspeed! Much interest today evening, warm thanks for your attention. 108 00:16:11,826 --> 00:16:15,696 Thank you Dr. Schulz, that's like music to my ears! 109 00:16:18,295 --> 00:16:24,157 Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to briefly describe what we came up with for this evening. 110 00:16:24,257 --> 00:16:35,105 As you can see from the invitation I wanted to show a bit about how Scientology developed. 111 00:16:35,205 --> 00:16:36,985 What is that actually? 112 00:16:37,085 --> 00:16:42,625 Many people who read or hear about Scientology in documentaries or talk shows see... 113 00:16:42,725 --> 00:16:46,883 ...always one man is playing a role: L. Ron Hubbard. 114 00:16:46,983 --> 00:16:50,754 Rightly so, after all it was him who came up with all of this hogwash. 115 00:16:52,136 --> 00:16:59,878 And because of what he developed we have to deal with this organisation nowadays. 116 00:16:59,978 --> 00:17:02,421 L. Ron Hubbard is dead, we are shot of him! 117 00:17:02,521 --> 00:17:06,513 That doesn't mean that his organisation is [unintelligible]... 118 00:17:06,613 --> 00:17:11,435 ...and above all he has a successor: David Miscavige. 119 00:17:11,535 --> 00:17:17,462 A man who came into the organisation practically as a child. 120 00:17:17,849 --> 00:17:21,996 Maybe one can also call him a victim of L. Ron Hubbard... 121 00:17:22,096 --> 00:17:30,291 who grew into [Scientology], knew no other world as is common with children in this organisation. 122 00:17:30,391 --> 00:17:38,751 There is now more controversy around this man as has been the case before, especially in the United States of America. 123 00:17:38,851 --> 00:17:45,950 Until now, if one has followed public debate, it was more about Hubbard and all of the things going on. 124 00:17:46,050 --> 00:17:48,206 And now it is about David Miscavige. 125 00:17:48,306 --> 00:17:54,068 That's good, because of course the new boss, from my perspective, when I witness him... 126 00:17:54,168 --> 00:18:00,759 ...observe or see him I perceive him as more fanatical than others. 127 00:18:00,859 --> 00:18:05,348 It may well be if you have such a troop and you have grown up there... 128 00:18:05,448 --> 00:18:11,265 that you might be - to put it mildly - slightly inclined to fanaticism. 129 00:18:11,365 --> 00:18:18,619 Now from the USA we learned - very much to the joy of all those dealing with Scientology - 130 00:18:18,719 --> 00:18:23,043 that in the last years many people have quit. 131 00:18:23,319 --> 00:18:30,287 So today we welcome some who have detached themselves many years ago and some who have not been out for a long time yet. 132 00:18:30,784 --> 00:18:36,369 However the major discussion about David Miscavige has been triggered by two men... 133 00:18:36,469 --> 00:18:41,456 ...that I have once called the right and left hand of David Miscavige in an interview: 134 00:18:41,556 --> 00:18:43,502 Mike Rinder and Marty Rathbun. 135 00:18:43,602 --> 00:18:47,097 I would have been very pleased if I could have had the two of them here today as well, 136 00:18:47,197 --> 00:18:51,576 but we're not that far yet but maybe some day we'll live to see that, too. 137 00:18:51,676 --> 00:18:54,396 These two... not only these two... 138 00:18:54,496 --> 00:18:59,759 Many high ranking people who quit accuse David Miscavige... 139 00:18:59,859 --> 00:19:05,731 ...and rightfully so of the things he does: He beats his people, throws them into water and such... 140 00:19:05,831 --> 00:19:09,215 And there's a discussion within the scene... 141 00:19:09,315 --> 00:19:14,302 ...but also beyond the USA, it has also reached the German discussion: 142 00:19:14,523 --> 00:19:21,878 Is David Miscavige, as boss of the Scientology organisation the problem, 143 00:19:22,265 --> 00:19:26,523 or do you have to start much earlier? Namely with L. Ron Hubbard. 144 00:19:26,965 --> 00:19:34,596 And to show that with David Miscavige, who in my opinion is a quite nasty fellow... 145 00:19:34,928 --> 00:19:39,462 ...according to everything you hear and read, having the power in his hands, 146 00:19:39,562 --> 00:19:45,323 I think it would fall short if we said David Miscavige was the one... 147 00:19:45,423 --> 00:19:51,516 ...who made the Scientology organisation in the last years to what it is today. 148 00:19:51,616 --> 00:19:56,604 That is - speaking from what I know - much too simple. 149 00:19:56,704 --> 00:20:02,465 If you are occupying yourself with Scientology and maybe the actions of the new boss you have to... 150 00:20:02,565 --> 00:20:07,386 ...deal with the ideology, meaning: you have to go back to the beginnings, 151 00:20:07,486 --> 00:20:14,520 to graps how a totalitarian system like the Scientology organisation could develop the way it did, 152 00:20:14,620 --> 00:20:21,542 that continues to exist in spite of many crises in many countries of this world, in spite of many disputes. 153 00:20:21,642 --> 00:20:29,173 Whether they happened in the USA, happened in Canada, France, Belgium or Germany. 154 00:20:29,615 --> 00:20:34,094 To date they have survived all of these crises and there are good reasons for it. 155 00:20:34,194 --> 00:20:41,449 And one of these reasons is certainly not David Miscavige, but the main reason lies with the system in general. 156 00:20:41,549 --> 00:20:46,646 That's why I thought that we start with those, 157 00:20:46,746 --> 00:20:51,844 ...who were really close to Hubbard in the beginnings. 158 00:20:52,176 --> 00:20:58,259 May I introduce: Hana Whitfield, who in the first years - she is going to tell us herself in a minute - 159 00:20:58,359 --> 00:21:03,401 practically grew up with Hubbard would be said too much, 160 00:21:03,501 --> 00:21:09,705 but experienced how among others L. Ron Hubbard founded the Sea Org, the elite unite, 161 00:21:09,805 --> 00:21:15,234 that we urgently have to talk about time and again, because it portrays the power centre of the whole organisation... 162 00:21:15,334 --> 00:21:18,055 ...and why it is this way. 163 00:21:18,155 --> 00:21:23,363 We will furthermore deal with the change of power... 164 00:21:23,463 --> 00:21:26,570 Hubbard dies, Miscavige comes. 165 00:21:26,670 --> 00:21:33,372 A contemporary witness, I mean there are a few more of them, but one that I warmly welcome is Jesse Prince. 166 00:21:33,924 --> 00:21:39,288 Jesse Prince had an encounter with David Miscavige of a special kind. 167 00:21:40,615 --> 00:21:46,974 We can insofar be excited about what he has to tell us. 168 00:21:47,527 --> 00:21:52,670 These are the set speeches, the scope of what's coming. 169 00:21:52,770 --> 00:21:57,868 Marc Headley is going to talk about the latest developments: What is happening now? 170 00:21:57,968 --> 00:22:03,840 What is happening in the USA? Which discussions are there? Which lawsuits are being litigated and the like. 171 00:22:03,940 --> 00:22:09,535 It's going to be exciting. Bruce Hines, who had the most diverse functions in Scientology... 172 00:22:09,635 --> 00:22:15,949 who knows a lot about the inner workings of the Sea Org, as do the others too but Bruce will report. 173 00:22:16,049 --> 00:22:19,544 But I won't forestall him as you will be astonished what is to come. 174 00:22:19,644 --> 00:22:23,359 And then - it is a joy - 175 00:22:23,459 --> 00:22:28,004 I really wanted to invite her and I didn't know how I would could get hold of her and it worked out: 176 00:22:28,104 --> 00:22:30,105 Amy Scobee! 177 00:22:31,100 --> 00:22:37,460 In our conversation we found out that we had dealings for a long time already without knowing each other. 178 00:22:38,068 --> 00:22:42,934 Because Amy was responsible for the watchdog committee back then... 179 00:22:43,034 --> 00:22:45,920 ...when the Scientologists in Hamburg were looking for a new building. 180 00:22:46,473 --> 00:22:51,173 And she was responsible that this would happen covertly. 181 00:22:51,615 --> 00:22:56,039 And she had this assignment from David Miscavige. 182 00:22:56,139 --> 00:22:59,136 She has alot to tell about how this was done... 183 00:22:59,236 --> 00:23:06,103 ...and which efforts were made so that the Scientologists in Hamburg would get a new building again. 184 00:23:06,203 --> 00:23:12,185 Those are exciting stories. Don't think the Scientologists and Miscavige are fare away. 185 00:23:12,285 --> 00:23:16,775 No. He's looking right at Hamburg, that's how it's understood. 186 00:23:16,875 --> 00:23:20,093 So we can eagerly await for this report. 187 00:23:20,193 --> 00:23:26,618 Furthermore - I know it starts to get annoying - for a long time she was the head of the celebrity center, 188 00:23:26,718 --> 00:23:29,548 the celebrity department of the Scientology organisation. 189 00:23:29,648 --> 00:23:34,967 She hates it to be asked about Tom Cruise all the time so don't do it. 190 00:23:35,067 --> 00:23:42,985 That's not the point but maybe we'll later learn about: Why a celebrity center? 191 00:23:43,085 --> 00:23:47,243 But to that Bruce Hines, Marc Headley and all the others will be able to say something about that, too. 192 00:23:47,796 --> 00:23:51,667 A celebrity center and why do we need these gentlemen... 193 00:23:51,767 --> 00:23:56,699 ...and what does lure these people in, we're going to see all of that. 194 00:23:56,799 --> 00:24:01,067 That would be one point, generally speaking. 195 00:24:01,167 --> 00:24:09,472 We then invited - because lately it was oftentimes discussed: "What are front groups in Scientology?" 196 00:24:09,572 --> 00:24:11,241 That word is mentioned time and again. 197 00:24:11,341 --> 00:24:14,504 Or what are certain groups that cover certain things? 198 00:24:14,946 --> 00:24:20,586 To that belongs, over and over again in discussions and frequently touted by Scientology: 199 00:24:20,686 --> 00:24:26,669 Narconon, the purported drug rehabilitation at Scientology. 200 00:24:26,769 --> 00:24:30,927 About what Narconon actually wants, its purpose... 201 00:24:31,027 --> 00:24:39,774 ...and what it - if I may quote you Jerry - which lies are being reported about this program, will be reported by Jerry Whitfield. 202 00:24:39,874 --> 00:24:45,636 And then we slowly go to Marc Headley, who you know from last year, as already said... 203 00:24:45,736 --> 00:24:49,230 ...new developments in the USA, the lawsuits. 204 00:24:49,330 --> 00:24:52,935 Then we jump over to us in Europe. 205 00:24:53,035 --> 00:24:59,183 In parantheses: to signify that what is happening in the USA... 206 00:24:59,283 --> 00:25:05,266 ...to the US American members of the organisation can affect every member all over the world... 207 00:25:05,366 --> 00:25:10,187 ...there's one example of a German member of Scientology... 208 00:25:10,287 --> 00:25:15,229 ...who for a long time worked in the Sea Org in the USA who is dead. 209 00:25:15,329 --> 00:25:19,587 His brother is here today. Welcome Markus Stuckenbrock! 210 00:25:19,687 --> 00:25:26,831 I don't need to mention that it's not easy for Markus to speak about this matter. 211 00:25:26,931 --> 00:25:30,757 I'm happy that he's here and we can really welcome him with applause. 212 00:25:39,328 --> 00:25:46,074 For further documents of what is coming from the USA to Europe... 213 00:25:46,174 --> 00:25:50,387 ...we invited the former chief of Scientology from Vienna. 214 00:25:50,487 --> 00:25:55,474 Welcome Wilfried Handl! He's guarding the door to keep us out of trouble! 215 00:25:55,917 --> 00:25:59,345 He is used to that from earlier days, I don't have to say anything. 216 00:26:00,617 --> 00:26:04,156 He will kind of be the "bracket", too. 217 00:26:04,256 --> 00:26:10,349 USA, Germany, Austria, what is going on in the German speaking areas... 218 00:26:10,449 --> 00:26:13,833 I think we have a tight schedule so let's start. 219 00:26:14,164 --> 00:26:21,408 We're starting with: What were the beginnings? Who was L. Ron Hubbard?